Lilly CEO has leaders talking about whether state is doing enough to grow Indiana

25 thoughts on “Lilly CEO has leaders talking about whether state is doing enough to grow Indiana”

1. As Ricks makes a $700mm investment in Boston 2 months ago…

   Our higher education is as fine as anywhere else in the country. Build it in Indiana, David.

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   1. We have good post-secondary institutions, but our public schools, public services, and overall quality of life are awful. People who go to those schools leave for other states and cities because they don’t want to live in a state that only provides the bare minimum and routinely sends itself on social crusades against minority groups.

   2. The fact that they didn’t invest in Indiana should tell you there is a problem with our state.

   3. Ryan, it’s not about the colleges and universities. Yes, ND, Purdue, IU, and Rose-Hulman produce well-educated STEM grads.

      But something around only 30% of Hoosiers have a higher-education degree. Those who don’t, the working folks who form the backbone of the state economy (and business hiring), are graduates of a middlin’ K-12 system. THAT is what Ricks and others are talking about.

      The market is telling Indiana that our high school graduates are fine for Amazon and Walmart warehouses, but not so much for new battery and computer chip factories.

   4. The question is whether or not a higher education degree is even particularly useful, or if it’s merely an indicator of a certain work ethic (which in itself is dubious).

      California should be the wonderland by most metrics, in terms of its labor force and quality of life. It has what are perceived to be world-class educational institutions (again, increasingly dubious) and its big cities are magnets for what they call the “creative class” workforce. Great weather, amazing natural features, a real concern for the environment. Yet it has been hemorrhaging jobs for two decades because of its lack of other business-friendly indicators. We can extend this reasoning up the West Coast, where the next two biggest cities (Seattle and Portland) have been godsends for their respective states…until recently. Even Amazon (which IBJ notes reported its first quarterly loss in years) is scaling back its downtown Seattle HQ due to a rapid deterioration in Quality of Life without a similar dropoff in cost of living.

      Most of the people on here are still applying arguments that were far more credible in 2016 than today. It’s fairly obvious we’re in a massive cultural paradigm shift, the chickens are coming home to roost, and the “cater to the college grads” ethos needs some serious rethinking. Not sure I have the solution, but ramping up “diversity education” in public schools (which, by virtue of being open to all and paid for by all, has a duty to being race neutral) has no credibility. Virginia has been leading the charge in fighting Mein Kampf for Black People and, despite being Dem leaning, elected a GOP governor for this express purpose–and it is ranked #1 in the country using the metrics seen here. Besides, well over 60% of Americans don’t have a college degree and will not get one. It is necessary to develop the workforce sectors that cater to them as well, not just expect them to feed on the table scraps.

   5. Lauren, you missed the entire point, until your last few lines: “well over 60% of Americans don’t have a college degree and will not get one. It is necessary to develop the workforce sectors that cater to them as well, not just expect them to feed on the table scraps.”

      When K-12 education graduates are better-educated, then businesses bring better jobs than the Amazon and Walmart warehouse scraps. Like the battery and chip factories announced for three neighboring states (who all rank higher on the story’s chart).

   6. Chris B, perhaps it isn’t willful on your part (we have long been programmed into College = GoodGoodGoodGoodGood), but that’s what I’m saying. I agreed with you until a few years ago. Then realized I just might be wrong (probably am).

      We have produced too MANY college grads nationally, and part of the colossal paradigm shift is a growing realization that the white-collar professional class is in surplus, as evidenced by the staggering number of college grads who are working retail and barista and restaurant jobs. While living with their parents and struggling to pay off even the interest on their loans. And the blue collar folks are sometimes getting less, since we’ve squeezed out the manufacturing that was the lifeblood until the 1980s. But we haven’t found a suitable replacement that can sustain a large middle class.

      Indiana is not going to be a well educated state by the metrics you and these muckety mucks are using. There simply isn’t the need for a high proportion of academic elites everywhere in the country (they stop being elite if they become too numerous), and the places that have become the hotbeds (nice weather, pretty landscapes for this are increasingly facing colossal problems all their own.

      At a certain point, this is me arguing against “trickle-down” (much like the left does) because the reality is that there’s only so much a national economy can sustain of high-paying white collar service sector jobs, when it is producing too many workers in that industry, many have to travel far to find work, and the places where there is a glut of high-skill work are increasingly staring down the barrel of a gun: namely, their high cost of living isn’t offset by a high quality of living.

      California is both a very rich and a very poor state. It has high proportions of both. But so do places like Brazil, Argentina, Equatorial Guinea, Nigeria. Heck, even Haiti has an elite. What distinguishes a robust developed economy is the fact that a middle class remains the sizable majority…which increasingly isn’t the case in CA, and other creeping third-world indicators are making it an increasingly difficult sell, even for rooted industries like motion pictures. ’cause it still costs a fortune.

   7. Yet as companies relocate from the West Coast to places like Texas, where do they relocate to? Places like Austin which are the highest tax places in Texas. Places with culture and a vibe.

      For all you who love to throw back at me things I said years ago, a reminder these CEO’s are saying the same things I have for some time now.

      The solution to what Indiana is facing is rather simple – properly fund K-12 education, roll back the higher education funding cuts made a decade ago and tie that funding to an increase in in-state enrollment… in majors that are useful. And do more programs like the recent READI grants paid for by the Biden administration to increase quality of life for all citizens.

      But that would require the Republicans to raise some taxes, so it will never happen.

   8. Joe B, a quick look at Texas reveals the folly of thinking that progressive policies matter for business growth. Facebook announced a major expansion in Austin after the state passed a controversial new law restricting abortion. Texas also has a RFRA act. Public policy is far less determinative of the economy than either conservatives or liberals would like us to believe.

   9. I’m speaking to the amenities and the sense of place that are drawing people to Austin. I guess I don’t think properly funding education is a progressive policy.

      Witness Indiana’s efforts to replicate the Research Triangle Park area in Boone County. I don’t think that’s progressive, I think that’s economic development.

2. Does our General Assembly have any will to focus on these fundamental issues and leave the bs behind???

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3. The fact that Ricks had to tell these “leaders” the list of problems Indiana has, is in fact
   the problem. But yea, guns guns for everyone.!!!!

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   1. What does our second constitutional right have to do with these unrelated issues?

   2. What we all wonder when the Legislature focuses on gun rights instead of what we’re talking about here.

4. Kudos to Bill Oesterle for smacking this nail square on the head and driving it flush in one swing! The “Highs and Lows” chart makes an interesting general case that those states with favorable “Cost of doing business” scores (OH, KY, IN, TN) tend to score low as you move right in the chart, until the last column “Cost of Living” where Indiana and Tennessee score as well as they do in Cost of business, with Ohio and Kentucky dropping somewhat. Very favorable Cost of doing business and Cost of living is evidence our legislature has structured a climate for business, commerce, and opportunity for good quality of life. The same business leaders that make a case for wanting our state to do more for education, healthcare costs and training likely are asking the states that have unfavorable “Cost of doing business” and “Cost of living” scores to address those issues. As Ryan H. above states, our higher education system is second to none … IU, PU, IUPUI, Notre Dame, Ball State, IN State, Butler and on and on. It is the responsibility of the resident STEM Corps. to recruit and employ the grads of these universities so they stay in Indiana. While the metrics of that same chart are fuzzy with a column like “Life, health and inclusion”, our state political and business leaders should take a hard look at healthcare costs and identify policy changes to lower those costs for all Hoosiers. With that said, we would all be better served if business and elected leaders adopted a Mitch Daniels approach to leadership … “Lead by Example”. He takes action to improve peoples lives such as the unprecedented action to hold tuition costs at Purdue for ten years running … and partnering with Duke Energy to pioneer the application of proven, safe, small-scale nuclear energy to deliver needed electrical power that is kind to the climate. We owe a thank you to CEO Ricks and others for initiating conversations on business, governance, and quality of life matters. Next move is to get them on board to understand that more government intervention is a very small piece of the solutions they seek and that they are the much larger responsible players to improving outcomes. It may be appropriate for Mitch Daniels to conduct a “CEO 101” class.

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5. There needs to be an acknowledgement that items like green energy cut both ways. High margin businesses like Lilly want to focus on achieving ESG goals and so are very pro-green energy. For many lower margin businesses, utility costs are a major expense. Indiana’s previously low electricity rates have been going up a lot, and it is no longer the low-cost energy state it used to be. The Indiana Chamber did a study on this not long ago:

   https://www.indianachamber.com/new-indiana-chamber-study-provides-needed-direction-for-state-energy-plan/

   Further green energy development could be a positive for the state, but it’s important to keep an eye on energy costs for the average citizen, as well as for energy intensive companies.

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6. Its not just about how much money you have in state coffers and your credit rating. Quality of life, good roads, schools, sidewalks, etc.
   Quit trying to see how “right” our legislation can be..

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7. Honesty is hard sometimes. The fact is that outside of Indianapolis and a few other pockets of the state Indiana is just not attractive to motivated individuals 25 and younger. The state needs to focus its efforts on changing that dynamic or it will continue to flounder.

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8. We can all learn a lot from the education format and system in other countries. The focus is not on everyone going to College, instead the focus is to prepare the student, starting at about the 9th grade, to enable the student to select an area they want to pursue (e.g. a baker, a mechanic, a hair stylist, a banker, a stock broker, a computer technologist, a programer, testing/QA, a scientist, a doctor, a nurse, a radiologist, etc.). From the 9th thru the 12th/13th grade, their career path is focused on learning a skill that business want to hire for the types of jobs they offer today and in the future. Post high school, the student follows one of two tracks – traditional college or a “trade” school. The” trade” schools further prepares the individual for the types of job openings (the trade schools are usually 3, 6 or 9 months in length). Not everyone wants to go to college nor does everyone require a college degree to do a job that business’s are screaming to fill the 11M+ current job openings in the US. Colleges in the last decade plus have produced “worthless” degrees with little to no demand for the skills taught. Alarms should be going off in our leaders that the education system is “broken”. Personally, I have hired over 5000 technical resources in less than 90 days (design, build software, test, QA, architects, etc.) to design and build world class systems operating in dozens of countries. You cannot accomplish this task in the US today in any state! If we sit and do nothing, businesses will not just look outside of IN, they will look to other countries, whose education system is preparing their workforce for the jobs that businesses need. The clock is ticking away and time will soon run out, if we do nothing.

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9. For those of you who missed it, Mitch Daniels made an excellent point in his recent Opinion in WAPO. The problems with our education system begin with the basics and Indiana has failed to establish and accomplish requiring the basics of education K-12. 40% of college freshmen must take at least one or more remedial classes, before they can proceed with their “higher education”. Think about that- a graduated high school senior has to take what amounts to a middle school math or reading class before they can take college accredited courses. That’s embarrassing for the kid and the school system from which they graduated. If you’ve checked out at a cash register in the last few years, you have no doubt encountered a young adult who couldn’t make change for a dollar and we expect them to be ready for the high tech jobs our economy is demanding?? Here’s the perfect example of how poorly our kids are prepared for life in the workforce: a recent Indiana high school valedictorian was ten minutes late for graduation practice. When the teacher asked her why she was late, her response was “You said practice was at a quarter after 9. A quarter is 25, so I am on time.” She was the valedictorian- received a full ride academic scholarship to a state college and doesn’t know how to tell time or what a “quarter” truly means! Think about that. This is what we are producing for our workforce and we wonder why Lilly took their business to Boston and Raleigh. We can fix the problems that all of these CEO’s and President Daniels have identified, but it MUST start at the most basic level. This generation has a world of knowledge in their hands, but they are getting dumber by the year. They have no problem solving skills, no coping skills, very little curiosity and even less desire to do anything that requires effort- mentally or physically. There are always exceptions to the rules. There will always be a handful who truly have the entire package. But if you haven’t met or spent time with teenagers and young adults lately, outside of your family circle, I challenge you to do so. You may see where we need to start to find these solutions.

   Here’s the article for your reference: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/02/14/lemon-law-for-rotten-college-educations/

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10. A good start would be to classify computer programming as a foreign language class. Instead of Spanish, teach Python. It could be just that easy. It could inspire thousands of Hoosier kids to go into tech.

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    1. Computer Science, which meant we spent the year creating and writing programs, was a requirement for me in 1985, why isn’t it still? This shouldn’t be an option, make it mandatory. If it doesn’t inspire them for a career, at least they will have the basic knowledge to understand how it works. The IT world is no longer an option, like a foreign language – it is part of our daily lives. These kids need to understand how that thing in their hands operates.

11. Ricks’ comments were meant to be thought-provoking but at least for some they appear to have been reflex-provoking instead. Some folks headed straight for comfortable zones where they have their talking points already worked out — college is the answer, no, college is the problem… quick, get me my California-bashing stick… green energy, no, not green energy… Texas is great except for Austin, no, Austin is great except it’s stuck in Texas… and so on. What’ll be a lot tougher, but maybe would be closer to what Ricks was getting at, is having serious conversations at a statewide scale and also in our local communities about (a) what future we would like to see for Indiana, and whether the present looks like that or not and in what ways, (b) what assets we have that are not merely exploitable in the short run (location, low costs for some things including some forms of labor) but can be a foundation for and a bridge toward that future, (c) what are we currently doing that’s getting in the way of our advancement toward that future, and can we stop doing it, and (d) what aren’t we currently doing that will need to get done in order for us to move toward the future we’d prefer. This’ll take a little while, and some patience, and we’ll all have to check our pet “simple-as-that” solutions at the door. Maybe one of our universities could host and facilitate the conversations (I think if one of our companies or our state government did so it might put some folks off of participating — but maybe people will feel that way about a university too — suggestions welcome), maybe Lilly Endowment could provide whatever modest funding such an undertaking would require (one or more facilitators, some refreshments, parking costs if applicable so that wouldn’t be a reason not to attend), and maybe the discussions could take place in various locations around our state and be remotely available in order to make them more nearly accessible. We need to develop some kind of roadmap and, to the extent possible, do it together. Then all of us could keep it in view when we’re listening to candidates and deciding on our policymakers. Comments? Suggestions for improvement?

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12. https://fb.watch/cPDpB8MzHt/

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13. Many good points have been made and yes we always need to be getting better in order to compete. Education could be better, the roads are atrocious and the city just isn’t well kept. What do people think driving through Indy during visits looking at trash, terrible roads, etc… All this aside my biggest criticism of this article or maybe the people quoted is that it always seems to be about catering to special interest groups. How about we all get out there, roll our sleeves up and get the job done.

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