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Good. I’ve predicted this outcome in the comments on the Pan Am stories for at least 2 years. Kite was never going to get this done. Sometimes you’ve just got to take matters into your own hands and make a move.
Kite was toast the moment they delayed due to COVID. At that time money was basically free but they flinched. Had they pressed forward the hotel would be nearly finished with the money borrowed at ultra low rates and occupancy levels returning to normal. Whoops.
Fire Kite.
How about investing in our roads and law enforcement instead?!
I do not think that is ever going to materialize in this city…at least not in the next 4-5 years….at a minimum.
Wet blanket, you are.
I love this! Happy to see this move forward…finally.
Amen
Agree! Glad to see the city step up and do something bold. It had to happen.
What a joke.
This smokescreen is amazing. It might be one thing if Kite was renting the City’s bonding authority to provide the debt needed for this project … (the City’s current muni interest rate is undoubtedly lower than the best commercial debt cost even at Fed Funds = .5%) But NO. Even with the city providing debt, Kite wouldn’t put equity into the deal. Why? Because it can’t pass a market test.
Conclusion: Joe Hogsett is now smarter than the market. He’s buying all of us a hotel.
Oh — and by the way, Joe, here’s how markets work ….. except for the handful of conventions we need rooms for, your hotel will be sitting empty …. Oh wait, no it won’t! Since your cost of capital will be the lowest in the market (since it’s 100% debt at public rates) your hotel can underprice rooms to stay full, shifting the disaster to the other downtown hotels. Your view: screw them; they are just rich private sector people. Welcome to the Peoples Republic of Indianapolis.
It’s one thing to finance unique city assets like stadiums and convention facilities. It is very much different to go into competition with the local business community.
Amazing hubris. And terrible public policy.
Sounds about right.
About the one thing we can hope for is that, since Indianapolis has only partially squandered its downtown to criminality (unlike other Midwest cities), there’s still some semblance of legitimacy to hosting events at the Convention Center. And it may be easier to pinch from cities like Chicago (the smaller ones), Minneapolis, or Louisville given how lawless things are there.
But that’s a mighty risky venture. There’s always the possibility that some orgs with long-term commitments to ICVB (like FFA) may violate if things get too dodgy downtown, or that they could easily renegotiate and host their event at series of hotels in the burbs. Or, even worse, political winds could shift so that our “root causes” prosecutors decide we should folllow the illustrious examples of Minneapolis, Chicago, etc and then we become just as lawless downtown. Which would inevitably prompt an exodus of events at ICVB.
In some of the cities hardest hit with the mindvirus, multiple hotels have gone into insolvency in just the last 2 years. Not saying that will happen here, but if hotels get built without abiding by shifting market trends (and the hospitality industry definitely has its ear to the ground), we could see the same situation through oversupply.
Would love for indianapolis to have downtown even a quarter as vibrant as Chicago or Minneapolis (Louisville is step behind Indy IMO). I think Lauren had not been to either of these cities in recent history other than in the world of fox news, Newsmax, right wing propaganda. Was in Chicago (in real life) last weekend and minneapolis month prior. At no time did I feel unsafe in their downtowns, nor that they were lawless. In fact, they are bustling, more so than indianapolis. Indianapolis needs to be bold in ensuring projects like this occur, but unsure if this is manner to do so (vs opening other bids for hotel in private sector). I hope this works out, and can understand that not making move to ensure this occurs is a “losing hand” within the poker narrative from administration.
Jacob M.
Downtown Indy used to ha e a vibrant party scene downtown. So sad that
has disappeared. If you’re going to have a thriving convention business you
better have a vibrant downtown nightlife scene also.
Otherwise the convention people will only want to get the hell out of downtown
Indianapolis as soon as possible. And probably won’t want to come back.
There are strategies that can be implemented to fill the vacancies on
1). The Circle
2). South Illinois
3). South Meridian.
It’s not brain surgery.
Drove down Virginia Avenue tonight. I get it was First Friday but it was pretty hopping. Mass Ave has also been busy when I’ve been out there in the past.
Is it possible the party has moved elsewhere?
Downtown is in for a rough couple years … they’re flat aren’t enough office workers, and without them you lose restaurants. I don’t know how that cycle gets resolved until (or if) enough commercial office space converts to residential.
Completely agree with Jacob M. Indy will soon get back to its previous level of vibrance and surpass that.
Michael G.
Cincinnati, Milwaukee, Columbus, and Nashville have already surpassed us
in downtown redevelopment. Louisville is nipping on our heals.
Indianapolis must be aggressive and not be afraid to think outside the box.
One thing that Indianapolis must reconsider is our financial relationship
with the Colts. We are subsidizing the Colts far to much. We can’t afford it.
That’s money that we need to maintain our downtown infrastructure.
I’ve been going to Cincinnati for decades. For a very long time, they were a city that fled back to the suburbs at 5pm and downtown was as dead as a doorknob.
Yes, they have the Banks. I wouldn’t call that “surpassing” anything in Indianapolis. It’s three blocks outside the baseball stadium. They’re trying to catch up… and they’re spending a lot of taxpayer money to do it.
One more thing – you complain about the money spent on the Colts yet praise Cincinnati, which even for a privately financed stadium is spending $200 million of taxpayer money. And if you don’t think the Bengals are looking for a new stadium while they have Joe Burrow (like the colts did with Peyton Manning) with an eye to getting what the Titans and Bills just got, you’re crazy.
Keith, you complain that everyone is surpassing Indianapolis but can’t explain how, then complain about what is done. The reality is everything has risk… Indianapolis could have well ended up with a big empty football stadium and looked like fools. Offer detailed, substantial ideas and stop playing buzzword bingo.
https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news/i-team/taxpayer-tab-on-fc-cincinnati-real-estate-needs-213-million-and-rising
No buzzword bingo.
I’m also well aware of the economic development and revitalization efforts in
Cincinnati such as Over The Rhine, The Banks, a new quest fir a stadium, and an expanded convention center.
Also well aware of the specific development and revitalization efforts in Louisville, Nashville, Columbus, and other cities.
Agreed that we don’t want an empty football stadium.
But I take issue with Jim Irsey taking all the revenue from
non football events also. We need that revenue for downtown maintenance.
Jim Irsey said he needs to be in the middle of the pack revenue wise.
The middle of the pack is Minpls./St. Paul. A population of around 3.7 million.
Much larger than Indy.
It’s like living in an expensive neighborhood can’t afford furniture
for our house.
Agreed that all decisions have risk that need to be assessed thoroughly.
Cost / benefit analysis.
Especially major public / private investment projects.
But Indianapolis still needs to be bold and we need to think outside the box.
So, your idea is to renegotiate with the Colts, who have all the leverage and a valid lease for another few years. And, oh yeah, an owner who spent the last year acting just as erratic as his old man.
“Bold strategy, Cotton. let’s see if it pays off for him.”
Oh yeah, you hit me with “be bold” and “think outside the box” and still don’t have anything substantial to add other than “Indy needs to do something!”
Hogsett tries to further expand the Convention Center and redevelop Pan Am Plaza (which is a dump) … and it’s nothing but complaints.
I mean, I’ve got lots of other ideas but I can guarantee they’d go nowhere.
Setup a long term plan to tear out the Inner Loop (have to expand 465 first) and turn the reclaimed land into new development around the city. Alternately, if you can’t overcome the INDOT industrial complex, bury the South Split and plan on doing the same with the North Split.
Reconnect the downtown canal to the canal that runs to Broad Ripple. Make this an amenity. Work with private businesses to make the area more resident friendly.
Tell Statehouse Republicans you will push to pass the measly $25 million dollar wheel tax they complain that Marion County doesn’t have … the minute that the state fixes the road funding formula so they stop robbing Marion County. Cross the aisle and work with Democrats who have tried to do fix the formula. Continue to work with mayors in the donut counties. And oh yeah. tell Aaron Freeman and Jack Sandlin and Mike Young that they should run for mayor if they want to run Indianapolis. Until then, go fix the road funding and pound sand.
Work to bring back downtown restaurants. Lower the parking fees in Circle City Mall – they were $3, now they’re $7. Subsidize rents for the first few years of rents for new restaurants with businesses paying more each year until they can pay full rent themselves.
Try the same deal for a downtown Target. (This era may have passed.)
Finish the low barrier shelter. Purchase apartment buildings around the city to serve as transitory housing. Get the homeless into these buildings and off the streets.
Ok, so what’s the alternative? I see you making a case for why this project is bad for the private sector but how does the city hold on to its major conventions we already have let alone attract new ones? Convention organizers already made it clear that the only way they will stay or new ones come, is if this project is built. The other hoteliers know this and didn’t come with with an alternative plan of their own. All I’ve read is complaining about this will hurt the private sector but nobody is talking about the BILLIONS the city would lose if they didn’t act. At the end of the day, the city has to do what’s in its best interest. Marriott and the other BIG hoteliers has 1000’s of hotels in markets all over the world. This Pan Am plaza project isn’t a deal breaking when there’s so many other major hotels in other cities that im sure Whit Lodge isn’t debating about. So why stunt the growth here in INDY? If this deal doesn’t happen, then the other hotels will suffer right with the city with lost of conventions. Now what kind of business sense does that make?
White Lodging and the other downtown hotel owners are surely going to have some feedback on this project.
They have for years.
Hoteliers oppose legislation that’s tied to convention center expansion
https://www.ibj.com/articles/72815-hoteliers-oppose-legislation-thats-tied-to-convention-center-expansion
Tourism experts disagree on wisdom of planned convention center expansion
https://www.ibj.com/articles/convention-expansion-a-risky-bet
Pffffffft! All the same criticism when the JW Mariott was proposed then built. That project treamdously helped Indy’s convention business. You’ve lost your credibility, Aaron Renn. Move on to other cities to criticize, which you seem to thrive up.
Do other commercial real estate projects that aren’t penciling due to financing get the same treatment? Cronyism at its worst. If it doesn’t pencil it shouldn’t happen.
And keep Indy as a backwater city while its peer cities advance…
Interesting. Seems Kite couldn’t get the financing at the rates needed,
Now! Will the project be as tall and grand as the original designs??
Or will it be scaled down as projects usually are in this city.
Sounds like no plan to downsize or descale the original proposal. Actually the proposed project is taller than what was originally proposed.
On further review, this article is 100% the position of the backers of the project. The IBJ did not interview any other hotel operators downtown, nor did they seek out anyone critical of the project for comment, nor did they provide any critical analysis.
What’s happened to you Aaron Renn? Used to enjoy your column. But you seem to have been consumed by the negative vibes of clearly elderly indy residents (aka CURMUDGEONS). You’ve lost your MOJO, big time. Very disappointed in you.
This will end up as an albatross around the neck of Indianapolis. When a government entity enters an activity that is the domain of the private sector, it almost never ends well. When it happens because the private sector player(s) are not willing to participate, that should be a HUGE red flag.
Minus the 15+ other cities who do this regularly…, sure?
What terrible job by Kite, way to drop the ball. It would have been interesting to see the city give other firms a crack at while dropping kite.
+ 1
+1
The city will build it and ultimately sell it to a private group for about 1/2 of what it cost the tax payers to build and operate it.
I am all for the city having a vibrant convention business but if the market says its not the right time to move forward then maybe its best to just slow down and wait for the market conditions to improve before the city and more importantly the tax payers to be on the hook for the project.
Why the preponderance of negative comments here? Most Hoosiers are sickeningly provincial and out of touch with the world. How many of you commentators have even ventured outside of IN? This project will help protect and build Indy’s convention business, one of the strongest sectors in Indy’s economy. May even help Indy land another hosting gig for a Superbowl.
Sorry, but Indianapolis not get another Super Bowl.
The haters (usually conservative Hoosiers), I guess want Indy to go backwards to the NAPTOWN era of the 70s. Cities like Nashville, TN will prosper, and so Indy should too!
I’m a conservative, I want Indianapolis ( especially downtown )
to thrive and grow.
Indianapolis needs to think outside the box as well as traditionally.
Indianapolis needs to be aggressive and think boldly with a vision.
We need local business leaders, the mayor, and our chamber leadership to
all work together for a greater good. A true bold vision for a thriving city.
We need a liaison from the mayors office to work with local businesses
Very closely to understand their needs for growing here in Indianapolis.
This actually sounds like a very Republican thing to do.